Jack In Spider World and Veronica's Ladders are fun to play and not bad for a new designer's first mansions.
Thank you Veronica - and welcome aboard again!

However, when the beta-testing for both mansions was apparently finished after only a few days I was already a bit "surprised".
Usually it's always the first mansions of a designer which need careful testing, as every new designer (and here I'm speaking from my own experience) tends to make several typical mistakes in the beginning.

In the last 2 days I've played Veronica's mansions - and indeed I can't help but feel that the beta-testing was not thorough enough.

For Jack In Spider World that means - we have at least one JS (see picture below) and a bunch of minor issues like cheap deaths etc.

Of course these are no big problems - but I feel it would have helped Veronica more if the mansions had been tested a bit more thorough even if that means it would have taken a few more days before release.

(Please see also my post in the Veronica's Ladders thread.)

Now for the Jack-stuck. It's right in the second room of JISW.

When Jack takes the platform to the upper walkway (to collect keys and money) he can jump up and land where you see his feet in my image below.....which results in a terminal JS, with not even suicide left as an option.

The platform simply travels too high up..... it doesn't take more than a (hidden) stop block to solve this problem.

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Thank you , AquaMat, for this post. :)

As you say it is difficult when you design a mansion  for the first time not to forget about something or overlook something.

But I have to tell you- hats off for that Jack stuck! I have been jumping around like crazy in this exact room to find If there are any problem points and not once have I been stuck up there!  :-?

Also- which cheap deaths do you mean? Some parts are deliberately made harder ( like lasers and meduza heads in front of a red door) but none of it is a cheap death If you find all the shields and you are fast (or slow, depending on the room) enough?  ;)
Please let me know so I won't do the same mistake in my next mansions.

Both beta testers were more than fine, I think the problem was that there was just too many things wrong in my mansions from the start, so of course you can overlook something. But again- I never ended up there and I tried deliberately to jump up from the platform, so that was quite surprising, that you managed that ::)

All in all, I'll be more careful with new mansion I'm designing now and maybe you would beta test also when it's ready? ::)

No rookie mistakes next time, I promise!  :)
Have a great weekend!

V.

No, no..... I won't call a certain section a cheap death only because it's a bit harder.....  so those medusa heads, or fat spiders or zappers are indeed no cheap death.

As cheap deaths we usually characterise only those situations that will almost always result in a dead Jack because they come so sudden or are otherwise unavoidable.

E.g.: Jack enters a room (either by walking on a floor or steppin' off a ladder etc.) and IMMEDIATELY there's a creature to kill him - a creature he had no chance of spotting before (or in time to avoid).... the same goes for zappers that are directly behind a room entrance and similar things.

Being often accused to include the odd - let me say - "sudden death" too, in my mansions, I am fully aware that some of these CDs are debateable.
But again..... it's one thing to do something like that in a "hard-to-very hard" mansion - but in an otherwise easy-to-normal mansion it can be a different story.

But don't worry - all this is really not meant as uncalled-for criticism of your mansions or something......

Below I'll try to attach one or two example(s) of CDs in JISW or VL.

Keep up the good work !

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PIC above - I don't know if it really qualifies as a CD....but at least it's arguably an "almost unavoidable" death for an easy-to-normal player:

When Jack comes up the ladder instantly 2 scorpions fall on his head.


PIC below -
This is also very hard - but I would probably not call this a CD - because those spiders are a bit slower - and easier to avoid than those scorpions above.
However - I nevertheless had to sacrifice a life there.....   :'(

These are only 2 quick examples I remembered...... to show you more I would have to actually go thru all the rooms again.
But I don't think that's necessary - 2 pics is enough....you already know what I'm talking about... !!?

But admittedly both of these examples are not really hard CDs compared to the 1 or 2 CD-spots I remember from VL.  (I'll see if I can find them again).

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Thanx again!

I know now what I have to be careful about and not  do again in new mansions ;)

Do you think this problems will affect players to that degree that it is sensible to correct them and send a new version out for download or should I leave it as it is, pass it as a rookie mistakes and not repeat them in next mansions?

Oh no.....
I don't think you need to make an update just for those CDs alone.... it's not that dramatic (especially not the ones in JISW).

You should repair the JS, though !

But you know what I usually do: when only a coule of minor issues appear (or are reported by other players) - I wait until I have collected a few more changes / improvements and then release an UD.

Only if a "severe" JS occurs I might do an immediate update.

If I were you, I'd wait a little more....see what other players report before I release an update.

PS: In JISW there are 3 black, empty rooms. What are they for?*
(I've only came across them in the Level Editor, while I wasmaking the screenshots for the above pics).  :-/  
* They are near the start and below the lower right corner of the mansion.

aquaMat wrote on 08.08.2009 at 05:08:08:

PS: In JISW there are 3 black, empty rooms. What are they for?* (I've only came across them in the Level Editor, while I wasmaking the screenshots for the above pics).  :-/   * They are near the start and below the lower right corner of the mansion.

...only the designer unless specified should peak in the editor... >.>

Thanx for the rights,Wingy :D

I used those rooms for maps- you know when you have to enter room ID on the map which rooms to show- even if the room doesn't exists.

I wanted to erase them after I was finished with the mansion design  but I didn't know if  the map will work when you pick it up :-?

OK, I am waiting dear MM players to let me know if a new version of either SW or VL is needed.

Thanx and -of course- have fun!

Hi Veronica! You have talent for creating mansions with big variations in the rooms. I like that.

There are some pointer I would like to make, esp. i Veronicas ladders, but I will mail you them when I have played through a few more times. I don't think you have to hurry to make an update.

@ Veronica,

you don't need to create empty rooms for a map.
In the appropriate fields in the map 'editor' you can simply enter room IDs - no matter if these rooms exist or not.

@ Wingy,

usually I second that emotion (although I don't think we should make it a "rule" or something). But in this case I needed to use the editor to (re-)find the rooms which had those issues I was talking about.... as I hadn't written down the room numbers and only vaguely remembered where they were.
However, I must admit that under normal circumstances I don't like it either when people are "examining" my mansions in the level editor!

(Even though I know it is happening occasionally - as I have seen a few of my design innovations / specialties being 'copied' by other designers.... !  :-/ )

Hi Veronika- excellent first mansions!

I did have one Jack Stuck: in 16904 I missed the jump up to the second skull and was trapped.

Also, here is another example of a cheap death: in 17103 I re-entered the room from the left and was immediately killed by the scorpion. (Compared to 16101 of Spider World: when you re-enter the room from the right it's impossible to avoid the bottom bird. I wouldn't call this a cheap death because I already knew the birds were there, and since it's an easier mansion I could afford to lose one life.)

Anyway, both mansions are fun to play, with lots of movement. Hopefully you enjoy designing so you'll make some more  :)

Great Job Veronika!

The other forum members have already pretty much covered my experiences in both mansions as well.  

Having said that, on the flip side of the coin.....you do have the makings of giving our expert CM creators a run for their money.  lolololol

I love the multicolored keys....lots of them.....they are not used to much, too bad, cause I just love their colours.  lololol  I see that you learned how to use those nasty flying fish creatively.  lololol  

Yep, I must say, for a beginner, you sure got some pretty great moves up your sleeve!   [smiley=2vrolijk_08.gif] [smiley=beer.gif] [smiley=dankk2.gif]

It's time to make a bigger mansion....it's over to quick.  
My Jack was just starting to get the hang of your style and it was time to go home.  Love all the cha-ching cash grab!  Makes me think I am in Vegas.  lololol

Dear Missy and other MM fans.

You will be glad to know that my new mansion Jack's BFF is in final stages of beta testing . It' s bigger- around 70 rooms ;)

AquaMat I will send it to you too, If you will be so nice and go through it before I send it off to Brell.  ::)

Regarding my first two mansions I will wait a little more If anything new comes up and then we will see If a new versions are needed.

Thank you all for compliments  ;)
I am very happy If you enjoy playing my mansions and this is a promise: I will only get better!  ;) I already learned a lot from my first mansions and know better now what I should be careful of  while making a mansion.

Stay tuned for updates :)

Hey there AquaMat....

Now you've done it....better get out a very, very fine tooth comb, cause we failing beta testers are going to jump all over you if we find a JS!
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

p.s.  I luv you AquaMat, I really do, but this is going to be fun for us and at your expense.   ;D ;D ;D

Hi Veronika,

Really enjoyed this mansion, one of your firsts, even a bit more than VL's.  Not sure why, just seemed more spread out, exciting, and a bit scarier for my Jack.  

Please keep up the great work, looking forward to your next one ...... "Jack's BFF" ...... care to wet our appetites with the full title?  Or would that give away too much?   ::)

Thanks again, and keep up the fantastic stuff !

SandyBean [smiley=2vrolijk_08.gif]

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